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標題: [硬件] Fermi Doomed [打印本頁]

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 07:16 標題: Fermi Doomed

GTX295 Level既卡, 成本高, 快唔過HD5970, delay 6個月

Byebye NVIDIA

作者: GeN~XP 時間: 2010-3-27 07:24

已經delay左好耐.....而家仲delay多6個月

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 07:27

引用:

Originally posted by GeN~XP at 2010-3-27 07:24:
已經delay左好耐.....而家仲delay多6個月

paper launch
4月12日先有貨 (>10000 pieces)

HD5850 < GTX470 < HD5870 < GTX480 < HD5970

作者: cheungmanhoi 時間: 2010-3-27 09:13

不過 470都叫勁過5850 咁都算有dd交代啦

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 09:14

引用:

Originally posted by cheungmanhoi at 2010-3-27 09:13:
不過 470都叫勁過5850 咁都算有dd交代啦

如果12月出就係lor, 而家4月都來緊啦

作者: cheungmanhoi 時間: 2010-3-27 09:31

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-27 09:14:

如果12月出就係lor, 而家4月都來緊啦

不過ati一打降價戰佢就:rip:

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 09:34

引用:

Originally posted by cheungmanhoi at 2010-3-27 09:31:
不過ati一打降價戰佢就:rip:

AMD唔駛打價格戰啦, NVIDIA都俾唔到壓力佢
唔好唔記得一唔夠貨, GTX4x0又要加價

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 09:40

http://www.xtremesystems.org/for ... t=248265&page=6

Post #107

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So after reading a good dozen or so reviews I think I have a decent summary.

GTX480
+Price / Performance level very near 5870
+Price is fair in regards to price based on the available alternatives (again point 1)
+Indisputably faster than the 5870, often with noticeable better minimum framerates
+Respectable clock headroom ( although I didn\'t see enough info on the increases in power / noise at overclocked settings )
+Very nice SLI scaling with 2 cards for a new release

- 100watts more power draw at load over a 5870 ( a common figure in reviews )
- 25watts more idle draw ( not terrible but not impressive either by any stretch )
- Hot as the lava in metroid ( pure pwnage reference )
- Loudest reference card
-Underwhelming performance at 2560x1600 ( although there are multiple mentions of this being driver related... which strikes me as odd )

So assuming they don\'t combust down the road ( of which Nvidia attest to not happening... ) if you have the power supply, cooling (ie adequete case) and money and don\'t mind the noise, the 480 is a decent card @ its intended MSRP. Now there is still the question of availability and potential price gouging.

All that said, a 512sp part on a smaller node would probaley be epic. Now wether we can expect to see this before ATI brings out a new line... doubtful. And as far as a dual gpu part, all I can say is good luck. Given Nvidia\'s claimed TDPs are easily reached ( quite interesting ), they\'d have to pull some serious voodoo magic to manage a dual gpu card that works AND makes sense at its price and performance level ( a very difficult prospect I\'d say )

作者: cheungmanhoi 時間: 2010-3-27 09:44

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-27 09:34:

AMD唔駛打價格戰啦, NVIDIA都俾唔到壓力佢
唔好唔記得一唔夠貨, GTX4x0又要加價

不過見佢果d dx11
http://images.anandtech.com/grap ... 610115215/22211.png
好似好勁咁wo

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 09:46

引用:

Originally posted by cheungmanhoi at 2010-3-27 09:44:

不過見佢果d dx11
http://images.anandtech.com/grap ... 610115215/22211.png
好似好勁咁wo

呢樣係GTX480強項

要睇DX11普及速度快唔快
照睇應該幾快, 對GTX4x0有利

不過年尾AMD又出Northern Islands
到時又唔知會唔會反超前
(Evergreen係無誠意之作, shader cut得又多, shader performance又低)

作者: Richteralan 時間: 2010-3-27 09:51

wow guess NVIDIA went way overboard with their GPGPU concept...

I\'ll only wait for low power laptop GPUs...lol

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 09:55

引用:

Originally posted by Richteralan at 2010-3-27 09:51:
wow guess NVIDIA went way overboard with their GPGPU concept...

I\'ll only wait for low power laptop GPUs...lol

I think Fermi is not over-stress on GPGPU.

Forced by AMD and Intel, NVIDIA is shifting from a GPU company to a GPGPU + Software company.

As a GPGPU card, its performance is unquestionable. Being faster than Evergreen family with a large (multiple times) margin in OpenCL / CUDA applications, Fermi establishes itself as a hot GPGPU card. I can bet on Fermi will gain a large success in HPC / Professional graphics / GPGPU applications.

As a gaming card, I would only say I am disappointed as GTX470 is slower than HD5870.
100W more power-hungry also counts.

作者: Richteralan 時間: 2010-3-27 10:02

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-26 20:55:

I think Fermi is not over-stress on GPGPU.

Forced by AMD and Intel, NVIDIA is shifting from a GPU company to a GPGPU + Software company.

As a GPGPU card, its performance is unquestionable. ...

yes what I was saying is NVIDIA spent too much resource on GPGPU aspect. And they missed on the gaming aspect.

edit: If NVIDIA will develop 2 chips, one for mainstream gamers and one for Tesla concentrating on GPGPU power, probably will be better. But then NVIDIA probably doesn\'t have that resource to do so.

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 10:05

引用:

Originally posted by Richteralan at 2010-3-27 10:02:

yes what I was saying is NVIDIA spent too much resource on GPGPU aspect. And they missed on the gaming aspect.

I don\'t know why NVIDIA chooses to use 1 single GPU for gaming + GPGPU applications.
Fermi for GPGPU and Fermi for gaming (gaming does not need DP programmable shaders)

Although RV870 is only decent in GPGPU applications, AMD still manages to cut RV870 to less than half for RV840 WITHOUT GPGPU enhancements.

作者: cheungmanhoi 時間: 2010-3-27 10:06

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-27 09:46:

呢樣係GTX480強項

要睇DX11普及速度快唔快
照睇應該幾快, 對GTX4x0有利

不過年尾AMD又出Northern Islands
到時又唔知會唔會反超前
(Evergreen係無誠意之作, shader cut得又多, shader performance又低)

無誠意效能高就夠

不過5830就真係

作者: Richteralan 時間: 2010-3-27 10:08

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-26 21:05:

I don\'t know why NVIDIA chooses to use 1 single GPU for gaming + GPGPU applications.
Fermi for GPGPU and Fermi for gaming (gaming does not need DP programmable shaders)

Although RV870 is only ...

hope NVIDIA can do well in GPGPU field and give us a better revision of Fermi....

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 10:08

引用:

Originally posted by cheungmanhoi at 2010-3-27 10:06:

無誠意效能高就夠
不過5830就真係

就係咁先慘, AMD係賺到笑

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 10:09

引用:

Originally posted by Richteralan at 2010-3-27 10:08:

hope NVIDIA can do well in GPGPU field and give us a better revision of Fermi....

You may better count on Intel for better GPU (Larrabee Generation X) for coming 5 years.

NVIDIA will not focus on gaming anymore.

作者: Richteralan 時間: 2010-3-27 10:11

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-26 21:09:

You may better count on Intel for better GPU (Larrabee Generation X) for coming 5 years.

NVIDIA will not focus on gaming anymore.

I don\'t think NVIDIA will give up gaming market THIS easily.
They still need this to push their PhysX.

And for Intel....I\'ll believe when I see it...

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 10:12

引用:

Originally posted by Richteralan at 2010-3-27 10:11:

I don\'t think NVIDIA will give up gaming market THIS easily.
They still need this to push their PhysX.

And for Intel....I\'ll believe when I see it...

PhysX is the saving grace for NVIDIA GPUs.
Many people just buy NVIDIA GPUs because of PhysX.

作者: Richteralan 時間: 2010-3-27 10:14

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-26 21:12:

PhysX is the saving grace for NVIDIA GPUs.
Many people just buy NVIDIA GPUs because of PhysX.

Then they need to preview the PhysX is doable with their own chip.

They are not a complete software company at least now.

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 10:17

引用:

Originally posted by Richteralan at 2010-3-27 10:14:
Then they need to preview the PhysX is doable with their own chip.
They are not a complete software company at least now.

You will need some time to show you are a software company.

NVIDIA is certainly heading this way and this is the best thing they can do against AMD / Intel\'s GPU invasion.

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 10:31

Sidenote:

Fermi boasts exceptional well CUDA / GPGPU / Tessellation speed.

作者: cheungmanhoi 時間: 2010-3-27 10:34

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-27 10:08:

就係咁先慘, AMD係賺到笑

在商言商沒錯wo

作者: cheungmanhoi 時間: 2010-3-27 10:35

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-27 10:12:

PhysX is the saving grace for NVIDIA GPUs.
Many people just buy NVIDIA GPUs because of PhysX.

不過有幾多人知自己玩果隻game 有沒phyx

作者: Richteralan 時間: 2010-3-27 11:08

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-26 21:31:
Sidenote:

Fermi boasts exceptional well CUDA / GPGPU / Tessellation speed.

I think this GF100 MIGHT not be the gaming oriented chip that NVIDIA intended to sell.

NV announce this first maybe because they want to maintain their GPGPU leadership. So this proves their shift in their priority.

作者: GordonFreeman 時間: 2010-3-27 11:11

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-27 10:08:

就係咁先慘, AMD係賺到笑

講真,所取所需姐
4系既卡仲係度,要CP可以買番佢地
想慳電可以買5卡
老老實實NV唔出DX11卡根本唔洗旨意等玩DX11 GAME,連3DMARK都要等埋佢......
5卡準時到達可以比人試住玩住先既
唔通好似NV咁8800走天捱咩
況且5卡係有提升到效能

作者: Richteralan 時間: 2010-3-27 11:22

preorder:
http://www.amazon.com/Zotac-GeFo ... 69600472&sr=1-1

$499 is not a bad price.

作者: irvingtin 時間: 2010-3-27 11:35

引用:

Originally posted by Richteralan at 2010-3-27 11:22:
preorder:
http://www.amazon.com/Zotac-GeFo ... 69600472&sr=1-1

$499 is not a bad ...

5870:
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_s ... 870&x=0&y=0

$420-$450
點都係 5870 底玩D

作者: Richteralan 時間: 2010-3-27 11:37

引用:

Originally posted by irvingtin at 2010-3-26 22:35:

5870:
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_s ... 870&x=0&y=0

$420-$450
點都係 5870 底玩D

Temporarily Out of Stock for most 5870...

and 499 is quite cheap for a release MSRP.

作者: 孔明 時間: 2010-3-27 12:01

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-27 09:46:

呢樣係GTX480強項

要睇DX11普及速度快唔快
照睇應該幾快, 對GTX4x0有利

不過年尾AMD又出Northern Islands
到時又唔知會唔會反超前
(Evergreen係無誠意之作, shader cut得又多, shader performance又低)

冇誠意唔係重點 , 多人買佢, 幫公司省靚招牌, 咁已經夠哂

作者: Tommi_Vercetti 時間: 2010-3-27 12:59

引用:

Originally posted by 孔明 at 2010-3-27 12:01:

冇誠意唔係重點 , 多人買佢, 幫公司省靚招牌, 咁已經夠哂

Evergreen我又覺得不算無誠意，效能其實也可接受 (expect 5830)

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 15:30

引用:

Originally posted by GordonFreeman at 2010-3-27 11:11:

講真,所取所需姐
4系既卡仲係度,要CP可以買番佢地
想慳電可以買5卡
老老實實NV唔出DX11卡根本唔洗旨意等玩DX11 GAME,連3DMARK都要等埋佢......
5卡準時到達可以比人試住玩住先既
唔通好似NV咁8800走天捱咩 ...

RV6x0 / RV7x0好似清哂貨

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-27 15:33

引用:

Originally posted by Tommi_Vercetti at 2010-3-27 12:59:
Evergreen我又覺得不算無誠意，效能其實也可接受 (expect 5830)

係你無睇in-depth定點

我唔知你點睇, 但我覺得:
1. Shader performance無理由下跌 (Rv8x0慢10%)
2. US$400同US$100 Shader數目相差應該係一半左右 (RV830係RV870的25%)
3. US$150同上代US$300效能應該差唔多 (HD5770慢HD4870超過10%)

作者: Aware 時間: 2010-3-27 18:36

友台多咗好多廢post，好多NV打手唔抵得Fermi doomed

作者: cheungmanhoi 時間: 2010-3-27 21:42

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-27 15:33:

係你無睇in-depth定點

我唔知你點睇, 但我覺得:
1. Shader performance無理由下跌 (Rv8x0慢10%)
2. US$400同US$100 Shader數目相差應該係一半左右 (RV830係RV870的25%)
3. US$150同上代US$300效能應該差唔 ...

我唔明2 3點解

作者: Aware 時間: 2010-3-27 21:42

睇咗唔少review，暫時結論係：
NV價錢:o)
不過相信NV已經嚴重蝕賣，冇減價空間。
Tesssellation用CUDA core真係掂，拋離HD5870相當多，係DX11 gaming會有優勢。
耗電冇眼睇，495永世唔洗出街。
:o) x 2036

作者: evangeline 時間: 2010-3-27 22:07

今次只有靠CUDA, 又唔快得過5870好多~

作者: Henry 時間: 2010-3-28 04:56

引用:

Originally posted by Aware at 2010-3-27 21:42:
睇咗唔少review，暫時結論係：
NV價錢:o)
不過相信NV已經嚴重蝕賣，冇減價空間。
Tesssellation用CUDA core真係掂，拋離HD5870相當多，係DX11 gaming會有優勢。
耗電冇眼睇，495永世唔洗出街。
:o) x ...

雙GF104.

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-28 05:04

引用:

Originally posted by cheungmanhoi at 2010-3-27 21:42:
我唔明2 3點解

2. HD4670 (64x5 shader) vs HD4870 (160x5 shader)

3. 9600GT ($150) vs 8800GTS ($300)

作者: cheungmanhoi 時間: 2010-3-28 11:34

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-28 05:04:

2. HD4670 (64x5 shader) vs HD4870 (160x5 shader)

3. 9600GT ($150) vs 8800GTS ($300)

第3就明lo
不過.........第2果點都係唔明
你指400元果d 同100果d 只係差1半shader?

作者: qcmadness 時間: 2010-3-28 12:02

引用:

Originally posted by cheungmanhoi at 2010-3-28 11:34:

第3就明lo
不過.........第2果點都係唔明
你指400元果d 同100果d 只係差1半shader?

高階同中階差50%效能已經好多

作者: Tommi_Vercetti 時間: 2010-3-29 02:16

引用:

Originally posted by qcmadness at 2010-3-27 15:33:

係你無睇in-depth定點

我唔知你點睇, 但我覺得:
1. Shader performance無理由下跌 (Rv8x0慢10%)
2. US$400同US$100 Shader數目相差應該係一半左右 (RV830係RV870的25%)
3. US$150同上代US$300效能應該差唔 ...

我倒覺得是A仔當初marketin時，預期廢米準時出到，然後把58系以48系的價錢賣，順手做多一次 sweet spot策略…
結果廢米遲大到，A仔點賺都得。

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